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Author Topic: Devils advocate
Dirk63
Naz Newbie
Posts: 31
Dirk
Post Re: Devils advocate
on: February 12, 2014, 08:07

MKDorman, I think, everybody should have the right of his own thoughts about the band and its history. I’ve only wrote about an article in “Bravo” from 1980 and there was reported about a conflict in the band. This is a fact and no speculation. And that there were conflicts in the band because of the music style is a fact, too.

I also don’t remember “Telegram” at the show in Mannheim at 3th of November 1986.

Nazfan_UA
Nazaholic
Posts: 205
Nazfan_UA
Post Re: Devils advocate
on: February 12, 2014, 08:21

Dirk63, I remember reading an interview with Manny, where he said, he didn't like the sound of Malice in Wonderland. However again, a producer can not force a band to play in another style, change the guitar/bass adjust to a softer sound, etc... I mean, this has to be a consensus between the producer and the band. And I also think that record companies can't force bands to play softer or heavier.

I think there were lots of conflicts because of the style. My guess: the heavy stuff of 80s is kinda compromis between AOR and hard rock. But compromis between whom? Dan and... Manny? Or...? Somebody gotta know this.

Still I would like to know the position of Zal Cleminson considering the music style of Naz in 1979-1982. At least he has contributed a lot to Malice in Wonderland. Maybe it was his and Manny's idea to play in AOR but sometimes delivering heavier songs.

nyssefan
Newbie
Posts: 20
nyssefan
Post Re: Devils advocate
on: February 12, 2014, 09:54

Guys, you are reading too much into things... suffice to say: when any band states "we split due to artistic differences" or "We disagree about the direction of the sound" or whatever.. that is usually just a nice way of saying "we are no longer friends". The fact of the matter is that Dan / Manny / Pete / Darrell played together for 25 years - and they did it very successfully. AND they all liked / still like the same music they always liked. Ask them today & you probably find the same answer: Elvis, Beatles, Little Feat, Otis Redding, Chuck Berry.. they have the same influences - so to suggest they do not see eye to eye when it comes to music is just bullls...

Also, keep in mind, as in any company, organisation - including in a band - you will ALWAYS discuss or talk about things and have minor disagreements.. for example, if you do not like the direction that the producer takes an album, sound or whatever: you discuss it, and usually you have a democratic agreement. Say for example, in the Malice album, if Manny would disagree with the production, he would certainly have made the point - but if the majority decision is against that, then the band agree overall to move ahead, and everybody get on with it. I think Manny also stated "democracy is a better way to govern than any other system we know about" - so they move on.

The only thing I am kind of sad about is that we never got to see the band reforming for a last gig / tour so we could give them a proper "send-off" before Dan left. I have always said they should have all been big enough to invite all past members, Manny Charlton, Zal Cleminson, Billy Rankin, Pete Agnew, Dan McCafferty + Jimmy Murrison & Lee Agnew - and do a final tour / gig. Call it "cashing in" or whatever you like, but that would have been cool. Look at the Quo Frantic Four reunion...

Sometimes, it is about saying "you know what, life is short and frail, and we all come from the same place.. lets all hug it up and be friends & lets ROCK it out". But, I am not the one to write history..

Will say though, that I have enjoyed all lineups of Nazareth, and every single album has had some quirks, tracks, lyrics or whatever to always keep my attention. I just love the Nazareth music. Always have, always will.

Rock on brothers. Peace & Love to everyone.

Dirk63
Naz Newbie
Posts: 31
Dirk
Post Re: Devils advocate
on: February 12, 2014, 14:45

Oh yes, a tour with all past and present band-members were really cool!!
Dan, Manny, Pete and Darrell played 25 years togehter, this is true, but not always successfully. Espescially the
second half of the 80s were not really successfull for them. I remember the concert in Mannheim 1986. There were about 120 people in the audience. And Mannheim has 300.000 inhabitants!
And Nyssefan, not every organisation or band is really democratic.
But I love the Naz-music too. All incarnations of Naz. Some periods were stronger than others, but in the end all
Naz-records are great and every concert I saw was cool.

Nazfan_UA
Nazaholic
Posts: 205
Nazfan_UA
Post Re: Devils advocate
on: February 13, 2014, 07:22

It seems to me somebody defenitely doesn't want us to know the reason of style change and Manny's departure. As your post only slightly reflects the topic: we're talking about the abovesaid, and you're talking about the tour with past members. It's a bit off the point.

Moreover, I'm strongly convinced, that there was no democracy in the band, and this was confirmed by my uncle, who is also a Naz fan since he was young.

Pal
Nazamataz
Posts: 90
Pal
Post Re: Devils advocate
on: February 13, 2014, 08:14

why so interested in why Manny left?
I've been a fan since 1973 and still love this band. It was a sad loss that Manny left, and I'm sure someone "know the reason". But I don't care. I guess Nazareth struggeled trough the 80's as many rock bands, they had played together for more than 20 years, everything comes to an end for all of us.
Let it be.

I would much more know what happends this year, with the possible new line up and the new album.
And also, if possible, a reunion and farewell concert in Alhambra. I'll be there, I'll be at the city hotel and I will have haggis for breakfast!

Pål

guenter
Naz Newbie
Posts: 30
Post Re: Devils advocate
on: February 13, 2014, 11:57

The uncle of my sister in law who knows the barkeeper of the drinking hole where the woman cleans who also cleans the flat of the taxi driver who is very sure that once he was hired to drive the band to the hotel after a show told me the real reason of the split was that Manny always used to fart onstage :o :o :o
DON'T TAKE THIS SERIOUS!!!

Look forward guys, you can't change the past ...

If we open a quarrel between past and present, we shall find that we have lost the future.
Winston Churchill

guenter

Dirk63
Naz Newbie
Posts: 31
Dirk
Post Re: Devils advocate
on: February 13, 2014, 14:30

You are right, Pal. It's not important to know why Manny left. I come to this theme because some fans wrote, Naz died for them with the leaving of Manny. I do not think so. I never was in the Alhalmbra. I hope I can realize it in future and Naz will play there in future!! If so, let's have some beer togehter, Pal. ;-)

Ron Lewis
Nazaholic
Posts: 181
Post Re: Devils advocate
on: February 13, 2014, 14:34

Agree with Pal, and Guenter, who cares, Manny moved on, he's been out of Nazareth for many years now. Man, I hope the new album comes out soon, so we can all talk about that. I know this forum is to talk about all things Nazareth, but really, we have covered this subject many times , just re-hashing the past.I love Manny...past ,present, and future, and I love Nazareth! Please...Give me the new Nazareth Album!!!!! Like right now!!!! Ron

That-
Family
Nazamataz
Posts: 55
Post Re: Devils advocate
on: February 13, 2014, 18:33

That's what that smell was. Thought it was something else. Oh well.

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